Barry HarrisThe method

Chris Parks · Stage 8: Thinking dominant

Don’t Think 2-5, Just Think 5

Episode 57 · 11:12 · On YouTube · In the lesson player

Chris explains Barry’s view that playing a ii-V makes no sense when the ii is already inside the V. On C minor to F7 in bars 3 and 4 of an F blues, he thinks only F7, using its three important arpeggios (F major, E flat major and C minor), then adds the tritone B7 and its own arpeggios.

Step by step

  1. 0:00Barry’s point: the 2 is already part of the 5, so think of it as one thing.
  2. 0:38Example: C minor to F7 in bars 3 and 4 of a blues in F.
  3. 1:16Forget C minor and think F7; C minor is already among the things you know for F7.
  4. 1:58Know F7’s three important arpeggios: F major on the root, E flat major on the seventh, C minor on the fifth.
  5. 2:35Make a phrase: start on the 4 of F7, come down to the 2 (the fifth of C minor), then down the C minor arpeggio.
  6. 3:42Try coming down the E flat major arpeggio instead.
  7. 4:24Bring in the tritone, B7: its third and seventh are F7’s seventh and third, swapped.
  8. 5:02Learn B7’s important arpeggios too: A major on the seventh, B major on the root, F sharp minor on the fifth.
  9. 6:54Know scales, thirds, triads and chords on both F7 and B7, and end your phrase on the next chord, B flat 7.
  10. 8:08Try thinking only 5 for a day or two; Barry said Bird and Bud thought that way.

Barry’s own words on this

8.1 Put the ii chord away6.1 Arpeggios on every degree; the three important arpeggios of a dominant scale8.5 The tritone

In the course

The scale every way: up and down, thirds, triads, chordsChord up, scale downThink the dominant: put the ii awayThe three important arpeggios of a dominantThe important minorThe tritoneThe blues the Barry way

Transcript

  1. 0:00Hello and welcome to episode 57 of Things I’ve Learned from Barry Harris. I thought today we would talk about the importance of understanding just five as opposed to two five. So in Barry’s way of thinking, he says it’s nonsensical to play 2-5 when 2 is already part of 5. And before, you know, a lot of people get bent out of shape about it, it actually makes a lot of sense. And it makes your life easier to look at it that way.
  2. 0:38It’s broken up into, instead of two things, it’s just one thing. Now there’s a lot of things in that one thing. And that’s what we’ll get to. And then you’ll see how, if you think about it as just five, it’s going to include everything and even more than people that look at it as two-five. So let’s take, for example, C minor to F7. And let’s say maybe we’ll use as an example the third and fourth bar of a blues in F. So we got one, two, one, two, three.
  3. 1:16Here we go There it is Okay, so we’ll think about that so again Barry’s way of thinking about it is forget about C minor Just think F7 now what he means by forget about C minor is not that you’re not going to use C minor But you don’t have to even consider it because it’s already part of your things that you consider for F7 I’ll give you example so one of the things Barry talks about on a dominant or F7 F7 scale, he says there are three important arpeggios, one that’s found on the root, and what he considers an arpeggio is a triad with the bottom note repeated on top.
  4. 1:58So if we have the one on the root would be F major, so that’s inverted. Then he says there’s an important arpeggio found on the 7th, which for F7 would be E flat, So it would be E flat major arpeggio. Then he says, and this is the important one, he says there’s an important arpeggio found on the fifth which of course gives you that C minor. And obviously in reverse.
  5. 2:35So now let’s just take a look at what knowing that, just that small amount, can do for you in terms of thinking about a 2-5. So let’s take a phrase, let’s just create a phrase, let’s just say, let’s start on the four and we’ll come down to the second, now I’m thinking only F7, start on the four, come down to the second, and the second is also, happens to be the fifth of that C minor. So maybe we’ll come down a nice C minor arpeggio, so maybe we’ll say,
  6. 3:09and then we’ll end it with or something like that, let’s see. Yeah, so maybe let’s try that one. One, two, one, two, three. Let’s see, there it was, right there, the C minor arpeggio. Maybe we’ll come down the minor arpeggio from the tonic. So let’s see what that sounds like.
  7. 3:42One, two, three. That works. Let’s see. It’s pretty. Really pretty. Let’s think of coming down, instead of the C minor, let’s think of coming down the E flat major arpeggio. So let’s try that. So let’s try that, let’s see.
  8. 4:24And if you can hear, part of what I’m doing also is I’m bringing in F7 tritone. So you got F7. And then Barry has the rule for the tritone, which other people talk about too, which is anytime you play a dominant chord that’s going home or a fourth higher, whether it be going home to a major, a minor, or another dominant, you can play its tritone as a substitute. And the tritone of F7 is B7. So what’s interesting about B7 is the reason that the tritone works is obviously the thirds
  9. 5:02and the 7ths are the two most important notes that dictate what makes a chord a chord, and they’re just reverse. So the 3rd of the F7 happens to be the 7th of the B, and the 7th of the F7 happens to be the 3rd of the B, and flip-flops. So therefore, anything that we do on the F7, and all the important arpeggios that we can do on the F7, we can also do on the B7. So, just for example then, the B7 has an important arpeggio found on the, let’s say, the 7th, which is the A major arpeggio. So we have to know our A major arpeggio.
  10. 5:42We also have to know the important arpeggio that’s found on the root of the B7, which is just a regular B major. we also have to know the important arpeggio that’s found on the fifth of B7 which happens to be F sharp minor so those important arpeggios can also be included in F7 so let’s try to use one of those things and also all the other things that we know how to do but let’s try to use one of those
  11. 6:18important arpeggios. So let’s say... Let’s see. There was... I used the important arpeggio from the 7th of the B7. So let’s say... Let me try to clean that up a little bit. So it works.
  12. 6:54And then I end it on B-flat because that’s the next chord that’s going to. So let’s try also what nice things are. From F7, obviously, we know how to play the scale up and down. We know how to play the scale in thirds. We know how to play the scale in triads. We know how to play the scale in chords. But that means you have to know the same thing for B7. And so on. So if we try to create a line using those kind of things, let’s see, maybe I’ll come down.
  13. 7:31I’m going to think about the second of the B7. Maybe I’ll come down a chord. Let’s see how that sounds. Let’s see. There it was. So how did I do it? Or... Well, I could have gone down the A there. But this is why if you start to think of all of these things that are included just in F7
  14. 8:08and F7’s tritone, you never have to think 2-5. and I would just suggest this for everybody that is going to immediately disagree with it, argue with it, it’s totally fine, you could do that. I would say try it. Try thinking of it this way and see how free you start to feel instead of having to think that you have one bar of C minor and one bar of F7 if you just think F7 the whole way. And F7 the whole way also means all those important arpeggios. It means all those half-step rules that we learned. It means all the chords
  15. 8:48up and down. It means all the triads. It means the important arpeggios, like I said, but it also means the tritone, the B7, and all of the things that we just said about F7 you could think of for B7. And then the only thing you have to worry about is making them sound right. A pretty way to end up on it, to end up on the next chord, which the following chord on the fifth bar would be a B flat seven. So those are the things that then you can worry about. Instead of thinking to yourself two five, that’s much too complicated. I mean, I can’t honestly for myself, because I didn’t learn it any
  16. 9:27other way. I only learned it this way. So when somebody else told me about this other way to think about it, where it was two five, it seemed odd to me because I never had to look at it that way. and it was just it was too difficult for me so anybody who wants to argue the point it’s okay you can argue the point if you want but I would say try it just try it and see what happens and Barry talks about this because he said that Charlie Parker didn’t think to five Charlie Parker thought five so he said the same thing about Bud Powell. Bud Powell didn’t think 2-5. Bud Powell fought 5. So,
  17. 10:09I’m going to go with them. I’m going to go with what he says they were thinking. I’d rather go with them. There’s a lot of things that we discuss that turn into kind of like these musical arguments, but musical arguments don’t really matter. The only thing that matters is how everybody sounds. So I would suggest just try it. If you’re a person that right now at this very moment says, well, I only look at things as
  18. 10:42being from 2 and 5, I would say, let’s forget about that for a day or two, and just try to work on thinking about it as 5, and see what you discover about your own playing. Anyway, that’s the end to this short episode, 57, which is, I guess will be titled, Think About Five, Not Too Five. Until next time. Thanks.